Tackling a 100-Mile Race with Very Little Prep - Dave Paczkowski

Hey, Athletes! Tackling a 100-Mile Race with Very Little Prep - Dave Paczkowski - Episode of The Garage Gym Athlete Podcast is up!

Tackling a 100-Mile Race with Very Little Prep - Dave Paczkowski

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IN THIS 22-MINUTE EPISODE WE DISCUSS:

• Jerred has an interview with Dave Paczkowski
• Dave is a sports and performance based PT who ran a 100 mile race on extremely limited training
• Dave goes through the ups and downs and his training through this experience.
• And A LOT MORE!!

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• Tackling a 100-Mile Race with Very Little Prep - Dave Paczkowski

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To becoming better!

- Jerred

Podcast Transcript

Jerred: [00:00:00] This is the Garage Gym Athlete Podcast, and we're here to build autonomous athletes and put phenomenal programming into every garage, basement, and spare bedroom out there. I'm Jared Moon, and I'm with Jill Courtney. We are strength and conditioning coaches who have turned over 20, 000 people into Garage Gym Athletes over the last decade, and we're here to reduce the information overload that exists in the health and fitness industry today.

We're going to do that by covering relevant science and give actionable takeaways, not only from the data, but from our years of experience. So let's dive in.

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the garage gym athlete podcast. Jared Moon here today with Dave Pachkowski. How's it going, man?

Dave: I'm doing good, Jared. I'm excited to be here. And yeah, excited to share some of the stuff that's been going on.

Jerred: Yeah, I'm excited. If listeners recall, I recorded an episode, it's [00:01:00] been a few months ago now.

And it was like, I don't remember the title, but it was basically how to prep for an ultra a hundred mile ultra marathon with no training, right? Something along those lines. And I was talking about how I did like a performance consult and I didn't mention Dave's name at the time. Cause I didn't want to throw him under the bus if he were to attempt to run a hundred miles or get severely injured or sick or whatever.

I've seen people get rabdo in these races, all sorts of crazy stuff. So anyway, here's the guy, the man, the myth, the legend, who with very minimal prep ran a hundred miles. And I'm taking basically all the credit. for the preparation. No, I'm totally kidding. I gave very minimal guidance on what I could not having run 100 mile race myself.

But Dave, welcome the show, man. And let's dive into it a little bit more. Let's just start with your background. So everybody has a good sense of what you do for living. And You're training, what your training is like, all that kind of stuff and family life. I think that's [00:02:00] important because a single dude trying to do something like this is very different than where you're at.

Let's dive

Dave: into it. Yeah, my lifestyle is probably a little different than David Goggins in terms of family life and some of those priorities maybe, but I'm yeah I'm excited to to have done it and connected with you. You are the. I know you mentioned maybe on the podcast, I think, but you were the one I reached out to, even without having run an ultra marathon, I I asked you one, if I was stupid enough to do it.

And you said, yes, you probably shouldn't do it, but I knew you'd be able to help me with not just getting I know there's a lot of people I could have reached out to that could have given me maybe a better step by step running plan or something, but that's what wasn't really what I was looking for.

So I'm glad we've been able to walk through this and you deserve all the credit. We'll we'll start with that, but yeah, I've I'm a doctor of PT by profession graduated coming on like 10, 10 years ago. So that's been the the my main, educational and work background.

I've always been in love with strength conditioning though. It's I'm, Definitely more on the less on the clinical PT side of things and more. I'm like a strength coach stuck in a PT's world. So that's that's [00:03:00] what I've always dove into personally, just with my training and helping other people out with performance and strength and higher level people than just necessarily recovering from a surgery or something like that.

But my training. Has looked very little like endurance stuff and very much I guess like power building would probably be the best way to describe it, power lifting focus, like lifting heavy but a bodybuilding style with that. Interesting enough, I hadn't done anything more than a 5k leading up to this.

And when I reached out to you in August, I I was seeing if it was possible and then what that roadmap would even look like to survive it. And finish it and not hurt myself or hurt all my my strength progress in the background or in the, on the path to doing that.

Yeah that's been my main focus, my family that we got two young kiddos at home. Our daughter just turned two this past August and our son's a six months Christmas Eve. So we time's definitely not not readily available. And, my wife's amazing.

She's at home with the kids right now, but, yeah, my, so my training over the last 18 months, I've, intentionally cut back to doing no [00:04:00] more than three hours a week is what I kept it at of three days. That was my criteria of three days a week and for an hour or less each day.

And it's been mostly strength focus. So it I wanted to see if I could do something like this with that kind of background and almost zero running

Jerred: experience. And you did it, man. Tell me a little bit more about the a hundred mile because. You had a huge audible, right? Like the race got canceled.

There was like a huge audible there. And then we can dive into like super specifics. I have very detailed questions about the a hundred miles, but what was your time overall and what happened with the the race?

Dave: Yeah, I finished so I finished race just under 27 hours, but. I I wasn't sure if I was even going to run it or what was going to happen.

Cause that it was December 2nd or whatever that Saturday was the the Monday before that I signed up for the Brazos Ben 100, which is out in Houston trail race. It was supposed to be this 17 mile loop at a state park that you do six times and they have their full set up there and they.

They sent an email out a few weeks ago of Hey, weather's looking kind of sketch. And then the Monday before the race, they were [00:05:00] like, Hey, weather looks too bad. We don't want to compromise the state park. And we're making a decision to postpone it to January. And this was the Monday before. And I'm all of my training, the last.

Three months and nutrition and everything like to peak me for this weekend. And I was already tapering down. Nutrition was already like leading up to, to run it that weekend. We found out what plan B was with that race getting canceled. I didn't want to, I definitely didn't want to run for another five weeks and we didn't even know if that weekend would work.

Started reach out to a friend of ours, Steve Weatherford out in Texas, cause he was set to run the race too. And he had a whole big. He had a whole crew coming with him. So I was like, Hey, dude, what's your what's your plans for this? And he just said, it's going down in Frisco, Texas. We we figured we were heading to Houston anyways.

So we detoured to to Dallas and still ran it that weekend. It was a hundred one mile loops around elevate life church there in Frisco, Texas, which was. Not on the trail. It was all on, on pavement which sucked for a lot of reasons. But I was ready to do it. I was mentally ready. I didn't want to train any longer.

And I, I know a lot of friends [00:06:00] that signed up with me, ended up just they're like, Oh, whatever. It's canceled. They backed out, but I'm like, I'm not. I didn't go this far just to say, Oh, I tried my best and leave it at that. So we went and got it done. It was just under 27 hours there. And it was I'm sure we're getting a lot more of it, but it was fun.

And yeah, I'm glad we just did that, but definitely not what I was expecting when I originally signed

Jerred: up for it. Yeah, dude, no way I could train any amount of time and then not do it. If they cancel the rates, I do exactly what you did. I don't care if I'm just running it in my neighborhood, for laps, I would have done the same exact thing.

I think that's awesome. I followed along on Instagram when you're doing it. It looked like quite a production, I know Steve has a good crew and like a community out there. But it looked like a legit, like sanctioned race with how everything was set up. So that's really awesome that you had there.

You had your pit crew, everything going in. I'm, I was joking with you after the race because I'm running a third of the distance and training three times as long in, like in months. And so I think that's one thing that has to be [00:07:00] highlighted, like why a hundred miles was such a little training.

You did it. So that's awesome. And congrats on phenomenal accomplishment. And there are very few people who ever say they're able to do something like that, but. Why not train for a year, why not put in more time or something like why go at it with such little notice?

Dave: Yeah, it wasn't necessarily drawn up that way, but we, so we had recently, I got started behind that we had recently revamped our family core values. And one of those was relationships and we just moved to a new area. So we were out in California for the first six years of our marriage.

We just moved out to we're in Alabama now and we, Have a whole bunch of relationships for fostering. And we had just recently revamped our family core values. And probably within a couple of weeks of that was when my first buddy reached out and he's Hey, dude, would you ever think about doing a hundred mile race in December?

And I'm like no, I don't want, I don't want to do that. And then had someone else reach out and they're like, Hey I'm doing this a hundred mile race. And I'm like, I was the one that Steve's getting everyone forward. They're like, yeah, want to come do with me. I'm like, no, still don't want to [00:08:00] do it.

So a hundred, it wasn't like a hundred mile was ever even on my radar. I didn't, it's not like this is a bucket list item or anything, but. I was I was just on a walk one day and kind of thinking about it and praying about it. I'm like, and I just, I don't know. I just feel like I need to do there's guys that we're going to, I'm going to be able to train with these guys who are doing this thing together.

We're going to be able to go on these training runs and it's, what better way to, in my opinion, I think one of the coolest way to build relationships is doing hard things together and stuff like that. So it wasn't something that was a bucket list item or something that I had.

Circled on the calendar. I've been like, Oh, I just want to see how hard I am to be able to do this thing in three months. It's just, that's the race people picked. And they were coming at it from the same training background as I was, or even some of them less. I'm like, Hey yeah, let's just, let's go for it and do it.

And that was the whole reason for that timeline. It wasn't I guess it wasn't anything that, was to see how much I can do in as little time, but that just happened to be the one that people were doing. And coincidentally most didn't end up doing it. So the whole it worked out in its own way.

But yeah that's how that came about.

Jerred: That's crazy, man. Yeah, I remember. So back in the [00:09:00] day I did an untrained marathon and people thought that was, but that was like legitimately untrained. That was like, I decided like on a Monday I was running it on a Saturday like no prep.

That was brutal. And so to do whatever more than three times that amount, four times really that amount is crazy. What'd you learn in the process? of prepping, we talked a lot about heart rate training, fueling, that kind of stuff. So I want to dive into the training first before we get to the race.

So you did have some training, right? It was what, roughly three months. Is that what you had? Yeah. Three months of training, three, three and a half months. What'd you learn in that process? Trying to fit in what you could in that three month time period.

Dave: Yeah. The it's totally different from what I was used to.

I still, when we talked, I'm like, Hey, I really want to keep my strength. Like my goal is not to do this and lose even backtrack three months. I did everything I could to hang on to strength. So I kept those three strength workouts. I had to modify a little bit of the intensity and I thought I was going to be able to maybe Yeah.

Hold on to things a little better in some ways, like I had to drop [00:10:00] deadlifting pretty early on, just didn't realize how much on my low back and hamstrings it was. My deadlift was finally working its way back up. And then it was once my long run started I just couldn't, I couldn't fit in during the week.

So there was definitely exercise modification. I cut percentages down a little bit and maybe bumped the reps up a little bit to more hypertrophy range, like we had talked about. But running was just, in heart rate zone training, wasn't anything I'd done before my pace is like my cardio only cardio is like hard Murph or like hard 800 repeats is like cardio.

I know, and then lifting heavy, like those are the two things I know, like an EO three, five K. As fast as I can or all power squat, squat as heavy as I can. When we talk zone two training, I'm looking at my heart, looking at the watch and I'm like, man, this is this is so slow. Like how do people do this?

So that was definitely a, there was definitely a mental learning curve with that of remembering that. Okay. It's time on feet. I'm going in uncharted territories, anything over, over my longest training run. I did work up to 30 miles, but anything over that, I had no idea what I was going to be getting myself [00:11:00] into.

So I think a lot of it was just a mental barrier of being able to go slow for a long time. And with family priorities and those things right now, it's okay, where do I fit this in? Because I don't want to. Go for a run at 8 AM on a Saturday and be like, Hey babe, see it. Like I'll see you in five hours.

And I didn't get to see the kids all week. So I was getting up at three 30 to, to do a lot of my runs and just. I only did two runs during the week and then one long run on the weekend was my schedule pretty much throughout the whole thing. So I did it on three weekly runs and the two, two were short ones before work during the week and then one long run, but juggling all that and trying to see where everything fits time wise.

Cause I don't, even over the last year and a half or since our daughter's been born a couple of years ago, I just, I haven't wanted to spend as much time training. So that was a readjustment back into, like you said, if I was single, it'd be no problem to. To find time for it, but fitting that all in with family work, new area current goals and everything was a lot of just juggling and learning that new rhythm over the course of those three months at least.

Jerred: Yeah. [00:12:00] That's the worst part about endurance training is the time. Like I'm dealing with it right now. Like I have some, even like a two hour run, three hour run. Those are things are scheduled as my long runs. And it's man, I got to do the same thing that you have, because like I have whatever, I'll have five games on a Saturday for my kids that we have to go to.

So there's no I'll fit this in unless I want to do it at eight o'clock at night and run to late, or you just wake up really early before anything starts. That's really difficult, but good on you for getting it done. But man, what's crazy is like how we set our expectations, right?

You said your longest run was 30 miles, your longest training run. And how did you feel? Cause you're not a runner, you're coming into this training with no running background and you just like nonchalant hit a marathon on a random weekend. Like, how'd you feel on that training day?

Dave: That was, yeah, that was definitely one of the most wild parts of it.

And Lindsay, and Jerry, we've talked before about whether it's business or fitness or other things, how quickly we forget our wins on certain things too, where you [00:13:00] just, you quickly forget that. Yeah. I'd never run over five miles and that was in high school. We did once a year, we did a five mile like football, which didn't make sense to me, five miles for a football thing we did once a year, but I'd run a 5k before, but never anything more than that.

And then I'm hitting regularly 20. 20 mile training runs and get up to the 30. And Lindsay's do you like, do you see what you're doing? Like you never have run more than five miles and your body's like holding up really well and you're just hitting 20 miles and how quickly we can forget those things with just wins in life in general.

Oh yeah. Even if this race didn't happen or I didn't finish it, which was never really on my radar. It's there are, there were plenty of wins along the way that, that definitely. You have to stop and pause and reflect on a little bit because that 30 mile run was one of those.

I'm like, Oh yeah, I ran my first marathon just on a Saturday. I got up and it was it was a lot of incline too. And it was trail. It took us, it took us a long time with. There's quite a bit of elevation, but it's just cool to even along the way, all those things that were the first of Oh, my first half marathon, my first, [00:14:00] 20 miles and you start getting up there.

And then you start, you're like, Hey, I actually can consider myself a runner now, even when, I'd never, I hadn't done much of it. And when you look at me, I'm definitely not the the natural runner build or anything that you might see at the front of a marathon, but it's crazy what.

What you can do, how quick things can change when when you commit to a goal and you start training for it and just taking steps one after another. And, but then it can happen on the other end too. I got done running what two weeks ago now, and I'm like, man, I can't picture running a mile right now.

Like that sounds terrible. And some of that's probably just not being fully recovered, but how quickly we can get out of that too. It's just when it, when you get in the rhythm of it and get going it's cool what your body and mind can accomplish with all that.

Well,

Jerred: that's just something to say about setting those high expectations. It's good. And it's bad, right? We need to take stock of what we've accomplished, but at the same time, if your goal had been a 5k in three months, which is a goal for plenty of people, that, that would be a big deal. Typically people are trying to go a little bit faster, like whatever in a 5k, but still.

You set the goal so high, a hundred, that [00:15:00] thirty probably didn't feel that crazy. I'm reminded of this constantly just with my garment. I'll run, I'll do my long run and it'll be like, you hit a PR. I'm like, what kind of PR, what PR are you talking about? They're like, this is your longest run. I'm like.

I guess it is. I've never ran that long before. And if it wasn't for the tech telling me I'm the same way I'm like, no, I have an ultra coming up in a couple months. That's my focus. How do I run that faster? Not am I, do I have any wins right now? It's very hard to see that stuff in training.

Now, how did your body hold up? So you're going from no runner, like not a runner, power building to, 30 miles is your long run, three days a week and and just so everyone listening knows, that's what I'm doing too. I, three days a week, that's all I'm doing for running cause I don't want to put in a hundred mile weeks or anything like that.

I just don't have the time for it. But what was that like for your body? Were you, would it hold up pretty well during the training or?

Dave: Yeah, surprisingly well. As good as I expected to I, I anticipate a little things coming up. Honestly, my own stupidity probably got me into more trouble than anything [00:16:00] during the training.

When I stuck to that three day plan, it felt pretty good. The, I had a, one sided shin splints come up maybe in October when I knew I had an event going on the following weekend. So I did back to back long days, which I hadn't done before. And I logged maybe 20 miles on one day and 15 or something next.

I'm like, Oh, I'll just do both my long runs back to back days. And that, that flared some things up that lasted for, eventually resolved itself, but a knee, I had some knee. Like it band type stuff on the right side, come up closer to the race. And Florida said maybe a little bit on, on race day, but nothing that was like, debilitating by any means.

I was really surprised, positively surprised how well things held up. And I think a lot of that's honestly a strength background. One thing I saw at the races, there was a lot of people that. Had you, you get running next to someone for awhile and you're just bopping and walking with, and they're like, Hey, what's you've done a lot of these.

No, you, they're like, oh yeah, no, I run like 50 Ks and a hundred Ks. And they're like, some of these people are hurting pretty bad. And I I felt like my body held up pretty good on race day too. And I think, especially on the asphalt, I think a lot of that's, [00:17:00] years of squatting and lunging and deadlifts and a lot of single leg work and things like I think.

My body was just able to battle better handle some of the forces than some of these people that regularly run 50 K's and they were doing their first hundred K or something there. Cause everyone's running different distances at the race. Some people were hurting a lot worse that had more of an endurance background.

And I just attribute a lot of that to years of foundational training and strength training that allowed my body to help hold up better. But definitely when I push the mileage faster than I should, I felt some things. Maybe start to flare out but backing off most things usually resolve pretty easily with Just cutting it back a little bit.

Jerred: It was the lunges man. Let's be real Yeah, so but no I agree I think that strength training I mean I haven't ran into any real Problems in my training volume right now. And I never really thought of why, but yeah, it's probably strength training, cause I know that has to be like shoved down [00:18:00] runner's throats, right?

Do your strength training, do your strength training. Cause they just don't want to. And we're like the opposite of that. We're like, we're good with the strength training. We're like, I don't really want to run, but I think it helps us out longterm

Dave: which is huge. Yeah. Actual strength training too.

And that's what, I think a lot of runners, they're like, Oh, I'm doing my strength work today. And they do two by 10 body weight lunges and some bandwalks or something. And there's nothing wrong with that. Yeah. It's yeah, basically stretching. Now there's nothing wrong with that, but that's like maybe a warmup for your lifting session.

So I think what they don't, where a lot of runners would probably benefit would be like, Hey, actually like load a barbell, learn how to squat and load a barbell up. Deadlift some, do some weighted lunges and actual actual strength work, not not this cross training band work and sideline clamshells and stuff.

Not that there's not a time and a place for it, but I think there's definitely, people hear strength and all sorts of different things in the endurance world probably pop into people's heads, and I think actually loading some things up would, more people would benefit from. Now,

Jerred: I've noticed that too, and it's interesting, both of our perspectives coming into Non runners starting to run more.[00:19:00]

And I see, I was like looking at some run programs online and they'd be like, here's the strength. And I'd be like, what are you talking about? And even if it's not that, say you don't want to lift heavy, like maybe you just can't fit it in. I think volume's got to be there then. If you can't, if you can't do the intensity, then you have to have the volume side, which I get could be dangerous with.

Too much run volume as well, but I do think something like your body weight lunges, for instance, or like Murph style, Murph level of 300 squats in a session those kinds of things with a vest all of those things, I think you're getting to a point where you're strengthening beyond yeah, the warmup sets, right?

You're getting into something there. And I think if you can add that to your running, I think it, it really helps. I honestly feel like my body became more bulletproof, like through. Strength training and Murph workouts. It's like a combination of intensity and volume And I think that goes a long way and definitely overlooked by most every runner that I've encountered so far.

I know heart rate training [00:20:00] was new to you and Something we talked about implementing during the race. So if we move to like actual race day I'd love to talk about what your strategy was You know, going into it, either if you were trying to stick to a heart rate strategy or run, walk strategy or whatever I think that'd be great for execution.

And then I'd also love to talk fueling because that's, I know that's probably a big one. So let's start with the actual execution strategy. How did you plan to execute and what was your plan for pacing and did you execute it?

Dave: Yeah, the so that, and that plan got changed that the plan I was working on maybe the whole time anticipating a 17 mile loops, a lot different.

In terms of just even like fueling and aid stations and those things to one mile loop and there's disadvantages and advantages to that. The the coolest thing by far was that I got to see my wife and kids a hundred times over the course of a hundred miles and run by them and see their, even just smiling and wait, like even just seeing them a little bit was something that.

I wouldn't have gotten, wouldn't have gotten at the [00:21:00] the other event, Lindsay got to run, walk 10 of the laps with me, mostly pushing a double stroller, which she's amazing on that front. And so that was the coolest part, but the, so the strategy changed and the challenging part was, okay, you see your wife and kids, every loop, there's going to be temptations to stop.

So I had to upfront be like, okay, I'm not stopping. Until every six miles was my like, I'm actually can stop and sit down for a minute and maybe get some food if I need to, if I need to change or anything. Every six miles was like my longer stop with with the plan to stop longer at 30 and 60 and 90, if I needed it was how that, that worked out with with that course.

Cause I didn't want to leave, I didn't want to leave a mental door open to be like should I stop this loop or should I, cause that, that, that would feed into much to. An easy way out if I'm just uncomfortable and I'm like, Oh, I can stop and sit down. So I had to have some of those boundaries on there of okay, I'm not going to stop until six mile mark.

And babe, I won't see you to stop until 12 miles and then 18. So I was able to keep that the whole time. And I thought that worked out really good for me. Tried [00:22:00] to keep heart rate as long as I can, but I think that, that goes, I would say it goes out the window, but it's hard to, it was hard to maintain the course dictated a little bit of the.

Each mile, because there were, it definitely wasn't a hilly course by any means, but there was enough like steady, low grade inclines throughout the mile course. And I'm like early on, I figured out, I'm like, I'm just going to start walking these, like I'm going to walk these inclines and run the flats was just how it worked out on a mile to mile basis.

And that naturally kept my heart rate pretty well within, within those zones, I would take a little more rest when I needed it if heart rate was high, but. Towards parts of the race. It's okay my, my heart rates, as soon as I start to run, it's creeping up. So either way, I'm just going to run this flat, get to the next corner and then walk for a walk for the incline.

So the course dictated that a little bit, but I thought the six mile strategy worked out really good. I would sit down at least sit down for a minute or, five, 10 minutes and grab some actual food. And in between those six miles, I was doing carb drink, electrolyte powder water, mostly some little like snackable things.

From a fueling [00:23:00] standpoint, but I thought it worked out really good. A couple of longer stops, gets harder to get going after you sit for too long, but I thought it was good mentally just to have some of those breaks in there too. So you

were,

Jerred: you changed socks every six miles

Dave: or maybe not every six, but yeah, maybe every 12.

I didn't have a set schedule necessarily on that. I went, I went off feel with it with a lot of that. I only had two pairs of shoes. I wore the ones were actually feeling good for, I wore those for the first 60 and then changed my other ones for the last 40 of it and then changed socks periodically throughout

Jerred: that.

And how did your feet hold up? I know there are a lot of horror stories of people losing toenails and stuff. How are your feet?

Dave: No toenails lost a little bit of bruising in the, like around the toes and big toenails. My first shoes, the Brooks were probably a little too narrow. I thought they felt good, like supportive wise, which is good on the asphalt, but they did squish my toes a little bit.

And then I had a pair of ultras for the other ones, which is wider toe box, which felt good on the toes. But by the time I was 70, 80, 90 miles in, it was a little harder. Like [00:24:00] just foot stability in those things, being able to, it required a little more out of my feet to do the work, which was a little harder at that point in the game.

Jerred: So where in the race did it get hard?

Dave: The funny thing, I don't see if and this, I don't have to strip you the wrong way, but honestly and I had some reflection things that I wrote up a little article on My five surprising initial takeaways from the thing. And one of them was like, the running the race really wasn't like, it wasn't that hard.

Like it wasn't as hard as I thought it would be. And honestly it's not hard compared to running a business, being a dad, being a good husband, like a lot of the things that we have to do. And that was one of the things just as you're running, you get a lot of time to think I'm like, this isn't, this is a lot easier than a lot of things I'm gonna do.

Even the things that Lindsay had to do that day. Like I thought, I'm like, I'd rather be here. Running and having to take care of two kids and two two kids under two sleeping in a car and car camping and her helping me and help another friend pick crew. Like those things seem harder to me than what I was doing.

And there, there are definitely points where it sucked a little bit. Like I had, there was like [00:25:00] stretches of kind of mini suck, whereas like from maybe 25 to 35, I was like, this just isn't really like. Isn't fun right now running the same loop over and over again. There was another stretch, maybe like somewhere late sixties to mid seventies, whereas another one of those stretches where I'm like, I just, I don't really want to be doing this, but there was never a point where I was like, Oh I don't know if I'm going to finish this thing.

Or it was just, I was. I don't think overly methodical, but having a one mile loop, it was very predictable in terms of okay, I know where I'm running to. I know where I'm walking to. Like we had talked before mentally okay, one, one landmark at a time, one mile at a time okay, no, like I didn't get too caught up in how much I left.

But that was the one thing that got me in trouble is mile 84 was the worst part of the race. That was, one of my longer stops. And it had to have been, I was trying not to watch the time too much in terms of what time of the night it was, but it's probably. 2, 3, 4 a. m. somewhere in there, and I got 16 miles left, which seems so close in 100 miles, but that's like I started doing math in my head and that's where I got into [00:26:00] trouble where I'm like, okay I'm down to, I'm running like 16, 17 minute miles at this point.

So it's not like I'm cruising by any means. The off the first 50, I was probably on pace for 24 hours or less. And the pace definitely slowed down in the last 50, partially being really tired, partially just, I don't know what to expect. And I don't want to. Yeah. I don't wanna zonk out at, mile 80 and not be able to finish this thing.

So I was definitely conserving a little bit, but mile 84 was just, it dropped into the thirties and I'm like, I'm freezing. It's the middle of the night. I'm tired. I'm like, I'm cold. I'm hungry. I don't wanna be doing it. And I started doing the math in my head and that's when you think you're closer than the yard.

You're like, okay, 16 miles. And I'm like, oh, at this pace, that's five. So you start doing math. And I'm like I, that's more than I, I wanna be doing now. But I stopped for a little bit. Lindsay had to help me. At that point I can't even change my own. Compression shorts and put on different leggings.

So she's helping me change. And that's, that's has this whole humbling piece of it. But so getting back out there though, I sat for a while and I was like, curl up in a sleeping bag. I'm like, I just need to, I just need to start walking and just take off on the next loop. Otherwise it's not going to get any easier.

[00:27:00] But that was a pretty rough stretch from even 84 up to 96. You think being that close, it'd be easy, but even within the last, it was the last until I got to those last few miles that it was like, okay I'm almost done with this thing and I'm ready to finish it.

Jerred: That's incredible. Yeah. I, to be honest, if you would have asked me where I thought it would get hard, I would say 75 to 85.

That would have been my guess. Just because exactly what you said is It sounds like you're so close. It's Hey, 75 miles in. It's dude, he's got a marathon left. Like that's a marathon after running 75 miles. Gosh, that's, that could take a toll mentally. So yeah, you really can't focus on the, on how much is left.

You can only focus on that, that one mile or like whatever that next thing is. I think that's really awesome, man. So let's jump back to fueling a little bit. You mentioned snackables and powders and electrolyte beverages, but did you ever feel like you. You bonked to rain out of energy, or did you feel like you stayed pretty on top of it?

Dave: I thought I stayed pretty on top of it. Yeah. I don't know if I feel too much. It's like in [00:28:00] hindsight, I was pretty, I don't say conservative, but that gets back into, even the difference between our races is, you can say, Oh, I'm taking, maybe I'm, you said, maybe I'm training too much with taking three times the length, but we probably had different goals.

I'm guessing you have some kind of timeline, some kind of time goal or something you want to hit with it. Mine was. And, the the original race cap was 33 hours and they kept that kind of the same for this race we were doing. So I'm like, I want to get under 30 is like my goal under 24 would be like, that's, if I'm really crushing it and I think I can push it.

But I I figured out pretty, by the time I was. 60 miles. And I'm like, I don't, it wasn't worth the cost to me to okay, maybe I hit 24 or maybe I don't finish this thing. So going into it, I was, the goal was to finish. And I think knowing what your win is in something like this is really important because I had another friend who she had never run anything like this either.

And she did it in 19 hours and something. And she, I didn't see her sit down once. And she was just, Going granted, she's also probably like 115, 120 pounds and she's got more of a runner's body. But I was I [00:29:00] was very proactive about making sure I stopped and ate and I felt I felt like I kept energy pretty good.

I tried cause I'd I tend to eat more. I don't like labeling, but like paleo ish like whole food type stuff. And you and I talked about a little bit leading up to race, but I tried keeping that for at least the first part of it. Cause I just knew that felt good on my stomach usually. And I was certain foods could bother my stomach and that's.

Probably the biggest thing that I was worried going in the race, that would be a reason I wouldn't finish would be like, if my gut totally totally went out on me. So I tried keeping it clean early on, but I went to PB and J's pretty earlier. Like potato chips worked really good. They actually had one of the guys there's, he has a coconut company and he brought, he had these, they had maybe three, four or 500 like whole coconuts that they were just cutting open and putting a straw in like hand and use it at unlimited coconut water, which was a little unexpected perk of the race. But yeah I tried to listen to my body a little bit on it. If I felt I needed salty, I went salty.

If I felt I needed sweet, we had. PB and J like [00:30:00] Nutella. I'm trying to grow their sweet stuff. I had some dates and honey and those were things, but like probably staples were like PB and J's and potato chips in terms of whole foods. And then I didn't do a ton of like bars or anything, but just whatever I trusted, whatever felt and sounded good at the time.

I, I haven't drank a soda and probably 10, 15 years, but like I saved it for like that two, 3 a. m. mark. I opened a Dr. Pepper and took a couple sips of like sugar, caffeine, dopamine hit that I had to look forward to. So I didn't have super strict guidelines going into it, but that's a, that's how I went about it.

I felt it worked pretty good

Jerred: for me. No stomach issues. That's awesome. And did you experiment with most of that stuff in your training or was there anything new that you added on race day?

Dave: I Hadn't done, I'd done some PB and J. I hadn't done, I didn't do any soda or anything like that. Most of the other stuff I'd done or something close to, I didn't specifically do potato chips, but I've had potato chips enough to know I felt it would be.

I felt it'd be fine. I'm trying to think if there's anything else out [00:31:00] there that I didn't use a lot of, but most stuff I kept pretty close to, I didn't do a huge variety of stuff. I tried keeping it. I'm fine eating the same things in general. So PB& Js, it wasn't like I was getting, I definitely don't want a PB& J anytime soon, but during the race I knew it was predictable energy that that worked well for me.

Jerred: No, dude, that's solid. I love PB and J. I don't eat as many as I should. If you should eat any amount of PB and J's there

Dave: At a race like this, you should

Jerred: get a lot of them. I'll definitely put, I know that would be easy on my stomach right there. Cool, man. Let's jump into recovery unless there's anything else from the race you think we should cover.

Dave: No, I think that's pretty pretty good on race day stuff. Yeah. If I think of anything else to go back on it, but we can jump into

Jerred: recovery. Yeah. So what was recovery like you just, and to note you, you went from running a race to hopping in a car and driving one of 12 hours back to Alabama. So probably not the best, probably maybe set you back an extra day or two, but what was recovery like Yeah.

Dave: Some of the things that you end up just [00:32:00] naturally having to do isn't the doctor recommendations that would would necessarily prescribe, but I you don't realize, or I didn't realize, it makes sense in hindsight, but I didn't realize how much of a comedown effect there would be and how, like how fight or flight on you are during a race like this.

Cause it's not, if I'm. I'm definitely, I was more nervous, I'm more nervous getting ready for a Murph or an EO3 5k that we're doing or something where it's I know I'm gonna have to hit this. It's going to be hard. It's going to it's going to hurt. And you got to come out of the gate fast with this.

It's the first mile everyone runs together and we're, you run a. 10, 12 minute mile. And then that's mostly the pace for the first, however many. So it's a different, it's like a different nervous system stress and a thing where you're not, I was never at the point where I had to get into that discomfort that you would think of with okay, I'm trying to hit a MRF PR or something.

That's like a different level of hurt that you don't necessarily get. But I didn't realize how much, even when I was sitting down to relax every six miles, how much there was okay, I need to get out there and I got another six now before, before I'm back in this spot. And you're always.

You're always thinking about the next thing. [00:33:00] Okay. What do I need to do to prep my body? What do I need to do? Fuel wise, what I need to have ready. So I didn't realize. And then as soon as the race was done, I went and sat down in the same spot I'd been sitting at and my body just you just let's go.

And I was. Nodding off in the chair there and I didn't realize the extent that would have and Lindsey drove home and I'm like, I passed out in the car. We didn't have a far drive, but I was just like out cold. And I went back and took me, my, my second ultra marathon was getting in and out of the shower and putting my putting my shorts on was like ultra marathon number two of how long that took after after the actual race.

But I went and slept for. Several hours at least then got up and pretty much whatever food we had around and sounded good. We had Lindsay had gotten some breakfast burritos. That's like just getting calories in. But I felt like my back was the most surprising thing that was really sore.

My knees were achy. My feet were obviously sore, but all those miles on pavement, just my back was pretty achy. And that was the thing for the next. Two days that like the getting out of the car, like old man, [00:34:00] having to brace myself on pull yourself up. If any of you guys had back injuries or back give out or anything it's not a fun feeling, but that was, like hard time picking my daughter up or something like that was it was maybe the biggest, like surprising thing that I had from a recovery standpoint, but.

that lasted two days or so. And then that was just general knees ache. My, my feet were sore. But the thing, the other thing I underestimated is I didn't realize like the low level inflammation that I probably still feel. I finished the race when we're recording this probably about.

Two weeks ago, 15 days ago or so. And I didn't realize how much like how much that would still be going on. I just feel off and sore and I'm not recovering as quick when I'm not doing anything heavy in the gym even yet. But it's still just taking me longer to feel like my muscles are fresh and recovered.

I still don't feel like I'm there yet. Yeah,

Jerred: no, I have experienced that just with Like bike races that I've done you, you just know when your squats not right, like when you load the bar and you're like, eh, this is just not, and it takes, it can take a while till you're feeling like, [00:35:00] okay, I got my power back, my speed back, my strength back, and I feel like that can take a while.

And it's like exactly what you're saying, just like inflammation, your body's not accustomed to. So scale of one to 10. How, like how jacked up was your body after the race

Dave: for two days, probably like eight, then that dropped by after two days, I was probably, probably cut in half. And then if it wasn't for my, honestly, if it wasn't for my back, that's why that was the most surprising thing.

I thought my knees and hips, like I thought my feet and ankles would be totally messed up. And I really didn't feel like the case. Like I was able to take some walks and those things. My back was what Really had me moving slow like where you can't turn it in bed feels like a max effort of just like Bridging up to scoot and those things so that was definitely far more Sore and I would say painful, but that was the biggest limiter if it wasn't for that I'd probably three four out of ten in terms of gently move

Jerred: around was that Low back that was hurting.

Yeah. Yeah. I could do it [00:36:00] all on concrete. Yeah. Oh that's brutal.

Dave: I know cause I noticed that I didn't notice that the whole race and I noticed it at a, it was maybe like around mile 90. There was so church was actually get in for session that Sunday, the race was finishing. So they have a 9am service.

Which I was hoping to finish by, but we didn't, I got done around maybe like just before 10, but there's a people coming in and some of the people are coming in support and cause a lot of people know Steve and a lot of the guys running it out there. And one of the guys came up and he saw me, I was just run walking by myself and he came up and he's Hey, how are you doing? And put his arm around me. And I like twisted a little bit and I felt this like twinge. And it wasn't that it wasn't him that caused it, but just that was the first time I was aware of, I'm like, Oh yeah that's something that I haven't, I know has probably been there for a while, but I hadn't done any twisting or a lot of bending to really know that it was flared up.

So that was I did notice it a little bit at that moment and kind of those last 10 miles, but that was yeah, that was. That was the most surprising thing, but not that surprising with however many steps on concrete.

Jerred: Yeah, man. When I did the untrained marathon, [00:37:00] I'll never forget. I can't remember the mile.

It was like in the twenties, I think. And I was running with one other guy and I was like Oh, we were hurting pretty bad, like our knees and everything. And we were like, let's run backwards for a little bit. Let's just maybe that'll help. And I'll never forget the pain as I just was running and making that twist.

Just all of them, like ankles, knees, back, everything. And then I started running backwards and that's also like when it clicked, I'm like, Oh wow, you're going to be messed up after this, that, that is, those are some serious pains, but it's funny. Yeah. And that's the thing with running. Running in a straight line.

To be honest, I hate it. It's not the best. But I think that's a good segue too, because I caught your email. If anybody's interested, Dave has a pretty good newsletter you guys should sign up for. But ultimately I loved your takeaways. You had a lot of good takeaways about like just running and all this other stuff.

I'd love to finish out. With those things, because I'm seeing a lot of similarities in what you're saying, like I've talked about this on the [00:38:00] podcast recently, I'm putting in all this runtime, right? So I have no time for any other kind of conditioning if I want to keep doing my strength training.

And so what I what I found is I just don't feel as athletic, I don't, and I don't know how to describe it to anyone else. If you haven't been like. More of a power based athlete cause I think my like super heavy lifting days are behind me. I've just got one too many serious injuries now.

I'm always going to lift, but I'm not going for any significant, like a 600 pound deadlift, anything like that. Those days are gone. Coming from that background, I just feel so unathletic. Like I feel, I don't know how else to describe it other than that. Like I just, like when I play sports with my kids, I'm like, yeah, like I don't just things hurt in weird ways.

I don't think, I don't see running being a long term thing for me. Like I'm going to do this one, who knows? Maybe I do another one. I do enjoy the conditioning aspect, some of the mental aspect. But I'm not in love with how it's making me [00:39:00] feel as an athlete right now. And I saw some of that in your takeaways and I was like, okay, this is awesome.

So I'd love to talk about that a little bit more, man. What are you? What'd you learn from becoming a runner for a short period of time?

Dave: Yeah, very short period. And I don't, everyone's Oh, you can do another one. I'm like, no, I'm like I won't say never because this wasn't on my radar either, and I signed up for it in three months.

So I'm definitely not ruling out that I would do something, but I totally agree, man, I think I feel far less athletic. I think overall, and I say this kind of with an asterisk, like I think overall, I feel less healthy in general. And I say that I didn't track, I didn't do any blood work before and after I didn't track my resting heart rate or there weren't a lot of things, maybe cardiovascular that I was tracking, but I feel like overall my mobility is definitely down.

My joints hurt more my gut with all the. With all the food I had to consume through training, adding in essentially doing what I was already doing, but adding in an extra by the end of it, 40, 40 something mile weeks, like that was hard on my gut. Just like taking in that much [00:40:00] food. And if anyone's tried to really like bulk before, they know it's it's hard to do that, especially when I'm used to.

Intermittent fasting and not eating much during the day. That's something we specifically talked about. I was like, Hey, you can't do that right now. That's, that's a lot of stress on your body and you need the calories. I think gut health was down overall.

I actually had some bad gut pain on my 30 mile run. I had I didn't mention this, but I had actual gut pain that like. Brought me down in a catcher squat, healed me over. And I'm like, and that's why I was concerned about finishing the race. And I reached out to a buddy who was a naturopathic doc and he got me in a couple of things that at least got me through the race, like supplement wise and those things.

So thankful for that, but gut health was down. My body composition, I didn't have the capacity to track a lot of things that maybe I would have in a different season, but body composition. Was in that negative in terms of about the same way that I maybe leaned up a little bit, but I definitely lost muscle mass too.

I don't think I look as good as I did before I started running where you think people are like, Oh, you run out, you're adding all this running and you're going to get super shredded. And I.[00:41:00] I was concerned enough about under feeling that I made sure I was eating enough to fuel.

So overall, my, my strength numbers were down, my power felt less, my athleticism feels less bending down to pick something off the floor. It feels harder. There's just like basic, getting on off the fourth, my kids, there's just basic things that I don't feel. As healthy with, so I think one of the takeaways is that amount of mileage at least isn't in my opinion, the best for long term health or the things that I'm trying to do either if I'm, if I, if it's a net negative on my health in terms of at least the things that are most important to me of like energy like mobility in general well, being body composition, strength, like if those things are all down, yeah.

And I'm spending an extra 10 hours a week training. That sounds like a pretty lousy trade off, like that's, if you have a specific goal to do this and there's a clear reason of why you want to do it, go for it. If there's a mental thing you need to get through, like push through or something that you feel like you need to, but in terms of doing it for health, I don't, I definitely don't, it wouldn't be something I'd recommend to people to, go train for an ultra or something like that.

I think [00:42:00] there's lots of better ways to do that in a much more efficient way as well. Yeah, I

Jerred: think the sweet spot, if you're just trying to hit some of the check marks that you were talking about hey, I want good body composition, I want to be strong, but I also want to run, and this is just through my own experience, nothing from like scientific data or anything, but I just feel like it's probably like 15 to 20 miles a week, I think that's about the threshold, because when I was doing that before I signed up for the ultra, that was about all I was doing three Runs a week.

I was actually feeling pretty good. I was like, Oh, I think I look a little bit better. Like that, those run distances were only about, five, six miles each time, like it wasn't that bad and I felt okay during that it's when you get these longer runs, like anything above 10 miles for me, I just I typically like right now I'm I drive, like I drive to do these runs.

I was just doing it from my house, but some of the roads around here are sketchy, no, no sideway no sidewalk or anywhere you get ran over pretty easy, so I go somewhere else to run, and when I come back, I always feel like what you're saying, I feel like an [00:43:00] old man getting out of my truck, and I'm like, there's no way this could be good for me long term there's no way Like you feel like this getting out of your truck and I'm not trying to take a crap on runners.

Like I'm running right now. I just think that there's, you got to know what you want, right? You got to know what your goals are and whether or not it fits. Because if you want to get shredded and really lean up and you want running, that's probably sprinting that's going to do that for you, like adding some sprints in there.

Because we all know sprints, that's going to tax the central nervous system, you're going to get some boost in hormones, everything else, those kinds of things are good. Maybe occasional like zone two work or whatever. Like I see the benefits in that, but these long distances, I think most people, it's powerlifting in my opinion I'm talking about like professional power lifters.

And cause I give them a hard time too, like in no way. Is back squatting a thousand pounds going to end up good for you? You see all these popular, famous, if you want to call them that power lifters getting hip replacements at the age of 40 and things like that. And so it's every sport.

And it's every [00:44:00] sport when taken to an extreme, probably not good for the body. And so I think that's probably what you and I are both realizing and trying to find that balance. Have you seen that in strength too? Have you ever overdone it with strength to where you're like, man, I don't know if I'm, am I going too far in, in the strength world?

Like you did in the running world. Have you ever seen that on the strength side?

Dave: Yeah, maybe less in the strength side. Just, it's just cause. I have more experience reps under my I think maybe I'm even subconsciously more aware when I'm getting to that point of, and I guess I didn't have that running and I had a set timeline of, I couldn't, I had some flexibility, but I couldn't just be like, Oh, I'm going to take two weeks off of running because my ankle hurts.

I'm like, I don't have two weeks to take off where I think naturally with. With strength stuff that, that with knowledge and experience and background, if I feel like I'm getting that point, I could be like I'm not going to back squat for two weeks and I'm going to, do some other squat variations or line, unilateral movements.

There's enough tools. I have my back pocket to be able to modify some [00:45:00] of that. I think would probably be the biggest difference, which has kept me pretty healthy from a strength standpoint. But I do think I've gotten into some of that when I've really pushed the heavy numbers more feelings of Maybe not specific lower back injury, but like lower back this, if I've been wrong, this could if I pick up my kid wrong, like this could end badly of not throw my back out, but, have having some of that, that increased pain and limited range of motion, all that.

So I think that's probably the close thing I've gotten strength wise, but I've, I've pushed numbers pretty heavy, but I've never done like competitive power lifting either. I absolutely think if I was doing that and changing my stance and different things to like, Absolutely move max load that'd be different, but I've I've definitely pushed strength numbers, but without the goal of like, how much can my body absolutely push?

I think there's always been some guardrails on that because I haven't, my ego hasn't overtaken me that much to absolutely see where my breaking point is on something like that. Yeah.

Jerred: And since you're not going to meet. You don't have to there's no reason like you'd be like it's 500 good enough or 520 really necessary You know [00:46:00] that you can make those decisions and I think that's probably maybe the ultimate takeaway no matter what you're training for is You know your limitations and know when to scale back if you want to stay healthy because that's that's my goal, right?

I just want to same as you I want to be In top shape for running my business taking care of my family playing with my kids but then like Still above average, like that's still a goal of mine. Like I don't ever want to relax so much to where I'm like. If walking is my fitness and I'm not like severely like sick or injured or something like that, then I'm doing something wrong.

I still like to train hard and do those things. Now

Dave: for You need a pair of, yeah, one of the New Balance I forget the brand of the shoe though, but the ones that, like the people that get total knees love, like the New Balance ultra supportive walking shoes. Send you some of those.

Jerred: And that's my kids, they wear Crocs all the time now.

It's I don't know. This drives me crazy. Like I'm ever doing fitness that I can wear Crocs in. You just take me out. That's it. Let's end it. But [00:47:00] all right, man, there are probably two types of people listening to this episode right now. One, there's the garage gym athletes who listen to podcasts and find this story interesting and what it's like to not train.

Cause that's the most fascinating part of this story is that you had very little time to train and you're not a runner, right? That's why like I could interview people who ran a hundred mile race, but I don't really care to, I really want to hear your story about what you did. Cause I think that's really fricking cool.

Just having done some of that kind of stuff, but not on that level myself. But then there are going to be the people who just found this through search. Yeah, they're going to be like yeah, I'm thinking about doing a hundred mile race. I don't really want to train, I don't want to train for a year or whatever.

Maybe I'll do three months. So I'm going to do Dave's way, so what would your advice to those people out there be? Should they do it? Should they not do it? Did you get enough out of it that you think it's worth it? What are your thoughts if someone's thinking about doing this themselves?

Dave: I'll circle back. Yeah. I think you need to have a very strong reason of why you're doing it. And I don't even know if I had a [00:48:00] strong enough reason, in hindsight, it's I, it was a cool accomplishment in that, but it didn't change anything about me. I feel, it's a cool accomplishment and getting the text from people and the, the things and hearing, hearing people's response to it.

It's cool, but I've done a. There's been a lot of, internal work over the past, probably five plus years that like, were previously I would have done it for those reasons of Oh, I need to like, really see what I'm capable of. And I want people like notice and think I did this cool thing and tell me, tell me awesome.

And I just, one of the surprising takeaways was like, those things landed empty on me. And some of that's, I'm trying to do a better job. Receiving those things and actually not just like discounting them because I've also gone through that of Oh, no, it was nothing.

It was definitely something. But yeah I just, I think no, really know why you're doing it, whether you're doing it in 3 months or. 30 months. Know why you're doing it. 'cause I don't think, we talked about from a health standpoint I don't feel better because of it.

I think there's a lot of things that go into that. And I found that during the race, I thought I was gonna have this I thought there's gonna be this like, oh I can't go on any further and God's gonna have to [00:49:00] speak to me. And and all these like big movie type moments gonna happen.

And it wasn't, it I don't wanna say it was underwhelming, but it was I finish and I'm like. Cool. Like I, not a cocky way. Like I knew I was going to, I never had a doubt of that. I wasn't going to finish this thing, which can lead you a little bit of underwhelm with it too. And I think that the slippery slope is that, okay, where do you go from there?

It's like the underwhelming part, if you're not in a really good spot overall and mentally and you're like, it's okay, does that's, that can be depressing if you're like, okay, I finished this thing. And I thought that would solve. Yeah.

And I think the other side of that is, Oh, I did a hundred miles. So what's next? One of the, one of my buddies that was there had just run the Moab 240. It's and you go down that route of Oh, I need to do like the next hard thing. Or you get into, I honestly don't listen to a lot of David Goggins stuff and I don't.

I don't care for him. Not because of what he says. I just, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. Not for me. And you can get into that mentality though, of I just need to like, go harder and push myself more. So just know why you're doing, I think would be a big thing. If you choose to do it in three [00:50:00] months, it's, it's a cool story and fun to talk about just because I get to connect with you and chat with you and, share it with people.

But I definitely didn't. It didn't have that effect that I thought maybe it would have. And I didn't go in necessarily looking for that, but you think maybe something like that would leave you feeling really accomplished. But I especially when a lot of my buddies dropped out for it, I was I was bummed.

Cause I, the main reason I want to do it was I want to do with a lot of them and they didn't, a lot of them didn't, I'm doing it for a lot of good reasons and stuff. But that was the bummer part is I wasn't looking to do this. I just wanted. Do something cool with a lot of people I love doing life with.

That'd be the first thing on it. If you're thinking of doing it in three months, I, reflecting on it, I say, I went from zero training, running a 5k to a hundred miles, but when I really reflect on it, I don't realize all the things I've done over the last 20 years. To put myself in a position to do that.

So from the physical side, I think really, knowing having a smart outlook, if you aren't really aware of your body and you haven't been training for the last 10, 15, 20 years in whatever way that is, I [00:51:00] would reach out to help for someone that, that, someone that can tell you if you're in a spot to do that or not, because I was, I've put my body through enough.

I would say similar tests is definitely a unique test to run a hundred miles, but I've put my body through enough tests to know how it's going to hold up and to know when I if I really hit the point of that's just not right. And I'm going to hurt myself if I do this. So that'd be the biggest concern if someone's thinking about doing in three months is make sure you have the right foundation and the right base.

And like we talked about, I think a lot of that comes from a solid strength base gives, gives me more margin and flexibility to go do something like this, but that'd be probably the biggest, concern yellow flat, like caution of make sure you have the right base going into this. Don't just do, three months of not doing anything and jump into something like this, probably wouldn't be my recommendation.

Jerred: What's funny is I had to, so when I read that, when I ran the untrained marathon, I had to go back and edit that article. I published that as an article on the blog, and I didn't realize how much search traffic it was going to get for people who were legitimately doing it, trying to do an untrained [00:52:00] marathon.

And so we're talking about from couch to marathon and they were like using my article as a guide. And I had to go back and edit cause I was just getting emails and all these questions and comments of okay. Like basically I don't work out, never really have. Shooting for marathon this weekend. What are your thoughts?

I'm like, don't do it. So I got to edit like the bottom of the article, like just so you know, like I've been training at that time, probably like 15 years. I've been training 15 years. I can run a mile like. Sub six every single time. Just so you understand where my fitness level was at my base, like you're saying to be able to do something.

And I think that's true of you too. This isn't from couch to a hundred mile. This is from barbell to a hundred mile, which is the, which is important to note because it's yeah, Dave has a huge. Training background. It just wasn't a running background. So there's, it's a different level of difficulty.

So I would say if anyone's listening to this thinking, yeah I don't do anything for fitness. Dave is no slouch. I've trained with him a few times. Like you, you know what you're doing, you know what you're doing in the gym. You [00:53:00] have a significant background and strength and everything else. So definitely I wouldn't recommend anybody.

Go completely untrained, but if you have a solid base it's worth a shot. But man, it sounds like you, cause I love, I just love the story, like how the picture is being painted, because you hear the opposite of everything you're saying when you hear about people running a hundred miles is they have this gigantic why you were like, nah, I don't know.

I'll do it. There's this revelatory moment, right? Like in the race and you're like, I didn't, I wanted it, but I didn't get it, and you're not addicted to it now. You're like, I'm done. I think I'm thinking I'm good. Cause that's all you ever hear when anybody else does it. Is there like, yeah, I ran this one race, I'm hooked.

I'm doing like three ultras a year and all this stuff or changed my life. And, because I know for a fact, like I'll run the ultra in April, I could run a hundred miles again later that year, whatever. I just feel like I know myself so well, I'm gonna have a very similar response to you. That's just my thought, like maybe something happens to where I get in a really low point and I do have this like [00:54:00] revelatory moment, but I don't know if it's Being a father to three young kids or my training background or military background or whatever.

I just, I'm not gonna, I know it's not going to happen. Like I'm going to do it and I'm gonna be like, all right, cool. Like that's over. So I'm just glad that there's someone else out there. And I do think that you have a really strong control of your ego though. It sounds like there's no doing this for the wrong reasons.

You know what I mean? Like you just, you want to do it with like you said, people you love and doing life with. And I think that's really strong and also says a lot about you and your character. You don't define yourself around these things. And I think that's probably what you and I have in common is like we can do some cool stuff, but we don't define ourselves from it.

And I think that's why we don't get as much out of it as other people would or do. That's just my opinion, my two cents as someone who I think will respond very similar when I do ultras in the future. But man, that's awesome. I you got anything to say on that?

Dave: No, I appreciate that.

I think we do have a lot of similarities in that way. And I think it's, it, we just get different, people get different things from it. And it's like the [00:55:00] thing, it's not the things I got from it were not the things I thought it would. And it's just I, it just revealed to me more, I was dreaming about it.

It's and I told Lindsay about this. I'm like the thing I. I didn't need to get any I realized I didn't need to get anything from the race and like the race just ended up bringing more of what was already out inside of me where I was running. I was just like, I was having fun and I was at, I was just like at peace and in the moment and just like just going.

And I, I just, I didn't have music on really or anything. I wasn't, hang with a lot of people, but I just think it was fun. It was a cool experience in a different way. It just wasn't, it wasn't this like big thing. It was just like, Oh, that was another fun thing to do on the weekend.

Let's go home and enjoy

Jerred: time with the most fun. You never want to have again, right? Never again.

Dave: Probably.

Jerred: That's true. I did mention you got your newsletter. You're doing a bunch of cool things. I've seen online, everything else. If people are interested. Like, where should they go?

Check out your stuff, learn more about you, all that good stuff.

Dave: Yeah. Instagram is the best place. I actually took a full year off Instagram and I'm back. I was, I'm back on it as of a couple months now, but Dr. Dave pack, [00:56:00] D R D A V E P A C. Follow me on Instagram. Yeah. Shoot me a message. If there's any questions you have or want to chat at all.

If you guys need any help with strength programming, that type of thing, I'd be happy to give you my two cents on it. That's the best place to find me though. And you can find pretty much anywhere else. I'll be on, on that platform right

Jerred: now. Awesome. Dave, it's been a great to catch up with you, man, and get it all recorded.

I had a lot of, hopefully the listeners got something out of it. I was just more curious about the actual process because so I asked questions super selfish to me. And so I'm hoping that other people wanted to know the same things that I wanted to know, but I just think it's such a cool such a cool accomplishment.

And I think it's awesome that you did it, man. So I really appreciate your time and for being on the podcast.

Dave: Yeah. Thanks, Jared. No, I'd find with it. I figured we'd, this pretty much would have been a phone call we would've had anyways. I might as well record it and share it out there. Hopefully hopefully people got some good from it, but yep.

Shoot me a message if you guys need anything and Jared, thanks for having me on man. Always a fun time. Yeah, man.[00:57:00]